CB radio & related information

good info! i always knew you were supposed to tune the antenna, but was never sure how exactly to do that. you guys definitely simplified it!!
 
Later today Im going to make a new thread for this, clean it up, and make a sticky. Great info guys, its much appreciated.
 
Some more good CB info I pulled from Brinker's CB thread http://www.rangerforum.net/f13/my-new-cb-3731/ . Thanks to Craig and Scrambler!

Diabolical Ranger said:
remember if you are not going to have a good ground to mount it on , like our fiberglass beds, by an antenna that is already made for such it is called a ngp

DO I NEED A NO-GROUND-PLANE ANTENNA?

Compliments of Firestik[SIZE=-1]®[/SIZE] Antenna Company Technical Support Team
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Copyright [SIZE=-1]©[/SIZE] 1996 Firestik[SIZE=-1]®[/SIZE] Antenna Company

No-Ground-Plane antenna systems have a very specific purpose. They should be the system of choice when you have no other choice. When your vehicle has little or no metallic surface area for the antenna to use as its NEEDED counterpoise your decision process should be;
1. I just won't have a CB in my vehicle.
2. I will use a ground plane (GP) system and suffer the possible consequences.
3. I will use a no-ground-plane (NGP) system and be able to use my CB.
In short, the NGP system (we call it a system because the antenna and coaxial cable are a matched set that may not be interchanged with other non-Firestik NGP antennas and coax assemblies) is a problem solver. If your vehicle does not provide sufficient ground plane for a regular GP antenna, the NGP system will solve the problem. Who should use an NGP system? Here are some probabilities. Those with ...
* Fiberglass or plastic vehicles
* Hot air balloons
* Wilderness back pack frames
* Fiberglass pick-up bed caps
* Aluminum and/or fiberglass boats and canoes
* Aluminum and/or fiberglass cab-over campers (antenna on camper)
* Aluminum and/or fiberglass travel trailers
The NGP systems are not "required" on metal vehicles. They will work but in most cases you are better off using a GP set-up if you have the reflective metal surface available. The ground wave field strength of a GP antenna on a metallic surface is about 15% stronger than a NGP system on the same vehicle in the same location. This is directly due to the way that the radio's power is delivered to the antenna via the special cable. There is some energy absorption within the cable assembly. However, and again we stress the specific purpose of the NGP system, it is better to have some energy absorbed in the cable assembly than it is to have no communications, or very poor performance with a GP set-up.
If your vehicle fits one of the above mentioned profiles and you are doing the first install, you should think of using an NGP system. Furthermore, if your vehicle fits the profile and you already have a disappointing performing antenna, you are a prime candidate for a change. Do keep in mind that the NGP antenna system will not fix the problems that are due to poor installation locations. That is, if you've mounted a GP antenna in a manner that prevents it from radiating energy into free space (usually shows up as an unmanageable SWR problem), the NGP antenna will fail as well.
As with most matters involving communications, we try to lay down some basic rules to help you before you get into too much trouble. While theory is okay for grasping a basic concept, if you let it give you tunnel vision you will probably run into a problem from time to time. We like a foundation of theory but cannot ignore over 30 years of actual experience in matters involving CB communications. Accordingly, we know there are exceptions to everything we write and say. But, when we write we need to aim the content towards the majority. It is beyond our capacity to write installation guidelines for every vehicle on the road and every possible location that an antenna could be mounted on the vehicle. For instance, on some fiberglass motorhomes with a steel substructure it is possible to tap into the underlying structure and get a GP antenna to work just fine. Likewise, many Corvette owners have attached a long mounting bracket to the right-rear frame and the good chassis ground allows the use of a regular GP antenna set-up. But, how do you explain to someone who just spent half a day routing cables and installing mounts that their problem is due to insufficient ground plane and they need to tear the whole thing apart and start all over.
There are some things you can do before you get too involved in the installation. First of all, find the metal. A one foot square chunk of metal on the roof of a motorhome falls under the catagory of "lack of sufficient ground plane mass". Every antenna has a somewhat different requirement. But if you don't have at least 9 square feet of metal (3ft x 3ft), don't even fool with a GP set-up. And if you do have sufficient metal mass, make ABSOLUTELY sure that your antenna mount is grounded to the vehicle in some manner, if not directly then with a short grounding braid or wire (minimum of 12 gauge). The fact that the coax cable may be grounded at the radio connection is NOT sufficient and does not exempt you from having a good chassis ground on the mount of a GP set-up. If you mount a GP set-up on an insulated roof rack, ladder, or spare tire rack (most of which have no or intermittent grounding), metal vehicle or not, you must run a ground from the vehicle to the mount. If you aren't sure what to do, you should find someone who can give you some help. Worse case, if you have a GP set-up and are wondering if it will work, than do a temporary installation. That is, put the mount in the area that you plan to make a permanent installation, ground the mount, route the coax from the mount to the radio through a window or door and do a SWR check. This could save you a lot of trouble and keep you from yanking us from your Christmas card list.
And last but not least, regardless of the antenna system selected, ALL transmitting antennas MUST be TUNED in their final mounting location. We thought that we would be able to stop mentioning this fact around 1978, but there isn't a week that goes by that someone doesn't says "Huh!" when we ask them if the antenna was tuned. Not tuning your antenna is the same as not putting air in your tires after they are installed. A tire without air is a flat … an antenna without tuning is a stick.

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Scrambler82 said:
Brinker88,
Have you setup your antennas yet ?

Why not to…
1) There should be at least ¼ wave length spacing between the antennas to get good performance, this equates to 9 feet minimum.
2) Hard to tune for low SWR: Each antenna needs to be tuned for lowest SWR by itself and on a separate piece of coax the same length as the Co-Phased Coaxial Harness you need to hook them up.
3) Needs special 75 ohm Co-Phased Harness.
4) Dual antenna harnesses tend to split up the power going out so the distance you talk will be reduced over a well placed single antenna.


If you are running extra heat then it might work but the main thing is the spacing, as in distance apart.

Why to do…

1)
2)
3)

There is no reason to use a dual antenna setup on a Ranger over a good quality single antenna setup.

Also, good coax is a must too !

And if you think you have an extra antenna because of running the duals just in case, just put the extra one in the bed box and carry it along and if one of the antennas go bad both will be unusable with the co-phased harness.

Do not use the FireStik NGP 3’ Antenna unless there is a real good reason that you can not get a ground plane, these don’t work as well as they are made out to.

Do not use a 102” whip over a well place single base loaded antenna, as much as people will not agree the new stuff performs better. With the mount and spring the antenna will be a ¼ wave antenna, no gain, just tall and gets in the way.
The newer base loaded units have better signal to noise ratios, better material and longer electrical length to introduce gain to the signal.

Sorry got carried away.
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There's an easier way to do this than spending that kind of money on a no ground CB antenna. Just run a ground from your antenna mount straight down to your frame.
 
In response to the dual whips, I have a cobra 25 classic with dual whips, and i only have one hooked up, the other is a dummie i just like the look of two
 
ok better late than never i guess here is a list of radios ants and mics. now keep in mind i am a truck driver these are radios i have run or have seen run, i also tune build and repair my own radios as a hobby.

Radios (listed in order of my person favs)

1) Older Galaxy 33hp from the 80s( newer are good but not as good)
2) Galaxy 55 great radio at a good price
3) galaxy 98 ( for those who want a big bad radio will cost though
4) a built cobra 29( has to be built to be up in th top) sorry
5) connex 3300 or 4400
6)styker (newest radio company on the market but they hit the ground with an amazing radio
7)cobra 148gt great stock radio
8)galaxy 44
9)night watch( same as a 29 just differnt face plate design and weather band
10)galaxy 959 or 979 great radio for the price but needs tweaked alittle)

NOTE: for those who want different colors you can change the color of the channel display and the back light for the meter on any radio made its a simple job with a little soldering. most specs can be googled to find the correct points to connect

Ants (this is a short list )
1)wilson 3000( best ant for any radio setup out of the box)
2)K 40( same as wilson 3000 really a tie for 1st)
3) wilson 5000(great for bigger built radios)

Note there are lots of them on the market but most would be way to much for your standard out of box or even a mild built radio. I prefer these over fiberglass sticks as they are easy to tune and the whips can be replaced as need from ie bent from trees

Mics

1)road king 56( great for any radio listed above. gives great sound while cutting out background noice)
2)astic mic( great mic has a more trebbile tone though can get hard to understand when radio is not tune correctly

Note. I do not recommend power mics while they are a great idea they tend to squel alot do you feed back. also i do ont recommend the look alike mics(rk 56 most common look alike)

coax tips.

Buy only the lenght needed and never coil it up as this mess up your swr.(always check your swr when making any changes to major setup. ie moving ants or power tuning the radio.

hope this helps some people again i now its alittle late but since this is a sticky and i have posted on a bunch of others that will fade i figure on last time here any questions PM me
 
ant ground improper

another quick note. I see so many people on here with ant issues. ants do not require a ground most of the time. those that do will have a factory installed ground strap off the ant. If you look at a brand new mount you will see there is a nylon or rubber space between the ant stud and the mount. this stops grounding. grounding an ant can cause power feed back to the radio and burn out your finals in the radio itself. please read you ants instructions to find out if at all it requires a ground
 
All antennas need a good ground to operate properly. An antenna works on the signal going to the antenna in an electrical pulse and then retuning to the radio ground and on to the battery, the idea is to setup a path of least resistance, so a good ground wire to the frame will help the flow and help create a flow back and in turn a good ground plane for the radio signals to work off of.
Some may have an inductive ground like a Magnet Mount and some MAY get lucky and get a good ground through the body mounts, hinges, bumper mounting and all of the rust and corrosion build up BUT… adding a ground wire can’t hurt.

You may have lucked out on yours and found the right spot and got a good inductive ground but not a good hard wired ground.

If you are mounting the antenna on a separate bracket, not a magnet mount, alway run an additional ground wire from the antenna mount to the frame of the vehicle, getting to bare metal where you mount the wire. Use Ring Lugs for grounding and good quality s/s external tooth lock washers and it doesn’t hurt to use some anti-corrosion paste on the connection too.

Mirror Mounted Antennas, they need a good ground too and as stated above add the ground wire from your antenna mount to the door frame and then to the frame, not just the body. Corrosion build up is the big ground killer and the only way to fix it is a ground wire to the frame.
 
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Anyone have more CB Info ?
Here is a little... about Antenna Mounting Locations.

The phrase, "Transmission Pattern"' this is the way an antenna put out or transmits the radio frequency when you press the button on the microphone and talk.

Remember that the body of the vehicle will determine the transmission pattern and the antenna will transmit the radio frequency towards the largest part of the vehicle body based on mounting location.
So what does does mean... if you mount the antenna in the middle of the vehicle or as close to it as possible the antenna will transmit in an even pattern around the vehicle.
If you mount the antenna in the rear of the vehicle the transmission pattern will towards the front and towards the opposite side that the antenna is mounted on; this applies to the front but in the opposite direction.

Take into account the transmission pattern when deciding where to mount the antenna.
Most people like the forward pattern so they can talk to people in front of them, that will require the antenna mounted in the rear, that simple. BUT... you do need a little towards the rear just in case the "Boys" are coming up behind.

I hope this is of some help.

Just to mention AGAIN... The dual antenna setup.
Remember, they need to be a minimum of 9.5 feet apart to work properly and if you do mount the two antennas and only use one there is two problems that will come up.
One is that the second antenna, the dummy, will couple with the one doing the work and may interfer with the transmission causing less power out and a screwed up SWR and second, with the real antenna mounted on one side of the vehicle most of your transmission power will go out the other side of the vehicle. So think on the idea of dual antennas before using them. Oh ya, believe it or not dual antennas, setup properly, will split up some of the power and in turn reduce the output of the system. Big truck use higher power CBs than stock so they can afford this lose.

What else, there are a lot of aspects of radio communications that most do not take into consideration, you really don't need to know it all but always tune your antenna to the total system by adjusting the antenna for lowest SWR.

Pay the most for the antenna and coax.

Luck to ya, I will stop talking now.
 
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It has been a little while and no one has bothered to add to this thread, a good one too but we keep repeating ourselves.

Maybe this info and other threads of this type need a separate Forum, maybe call it "Radio Communications - CB and HAM".
Extra work for the Admin having an additional forum but it seems that this topic keeps coming up and the same info is being tossed around time and time again, so maybe it is not as accessible as it need to be.

Just a suggestion, I like helping anyone with their CB or HAM setups, antennas and coax are animals all to themselves and need attention when installed but lets get it together in one place.

Thanks for listening and post up people, we can all learn new things.
 
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